Unstoppable. The More People see Wind Energy, the More they Like it

September 7, 2016

michigantenth

Michigan’s “Thumb” area is deeply conservative, and the 10th Congressional District (see map) is listed as a safe Republican stronghold. The Thumb is also home to a high concentration of Michigan’s wind turbines, as the flat farmland, bounded by Saginaw Bay and Lake Huron, is swept by steady winds throughout the year.
What do these folks think of Wind energy?

American Wind Energy Association:

Michigan is a wind manufacturing heavyweight. 26 factories employ well-paid workers and build wind turbine parts and supplies, which are delivered to U.S. wind farms across the region. Apparently Michigan voters have noticed that the added benefit of growing wind power in the U.S. means good news for the Michigan economy. A poll released by American Wind Action just last week finds support for wind among 81 percent of Michigan’s Tenth Congressional District. That includes broad support across party lines, with at least three-quarters of Republicans, Independents and Democrats having a favorable impression of wind.

Iowa obtained nearly one-third, 31 percent, of its electricity from wind energy last  year. And Iowa’s Third District ranks in the top 20 U.S. Congressional districts for the most wind capacity, a new drought-resistant cash crop for the state’s farmers. The Third District also happens to be the home to the tallest operating U.S. wind turbine in the country. All of this simply means, out of the more than $11 billion in capital investment that wind power has attracted to local economies in Iowa so far, the Third District has seen some great benefits. That’s why it’s not surprising that a recent poll found 91 percent of respondents in that District support wind energy.

All of this data continues support strong polling results found elsewhere this year. Lazard, a highly reputable financial advisory and asset management firm, found bipartisan support for clean energy policies has increased among U.S. voters, with 91 percent of likely voters and over 80 percent of self-described conservatives supporting wind energy growth. According to North American Windpower, 70 percent of likely voters in 2016 support legislation that requires energy companies to generate 15 percent of their power from alternative energy sources over the next several years, up from 60 percent of voters in 2012.

Below, David Jenkins, president, Conservatives for Responsible Stewardship in the Knoxville News-Sentinel.

As a long-time conservative who loves wildlife, enjoys the great outdoors and strongly advocates for responsible environmental stewardship, I believe some of your readers aren’t being told about the significant economic and environmental benefits of using more wind energy to power our homes and our lives.

turbines0413

Studies show that wind energy has the lowest impact on wildlife and its habitat of any energy source. It emits no air or water pollution, requires no fuel, uses virtually no water, creates no hazardous waste, and a typical wind project repays its carbon footprint in six months or less, providing zero-emission energy and reducing the need to burn fossil fuels.

That’s why Audubon, a group dedicated specifically to bird conservation, “strongly supports properly sited wind power as an energy source” because it “helps reduce the threats posed to birds and people by climate change.”

In 2015 alone, the use of wind energy prevented more than 28 million cars’ worth of carbon pollution, and over the last decade it has accounted for 77 percent of U.S. growth in non-polluting power generation.

That’s just on the environmental side. There are a tremendous number of economic benefits, too.

Because wind power’s costs have dropped by two-thirds over just six years, wind energy has become the cheapest source of electricity in some parts of the country. And the U.S. Department of Energy says growing wind power in Tennessee could result in $4.4 billion in cumulative savings by 2050, with an additional $3.55 billion in savings from wind’s impact on natural gas prices.

The Hill:

Iowa Sen. Chuck Grassley (R) says he won’t allow Republican nominee Donald Trump to attack wind energy if he wins the presidential election.

Grassley, running for re-election in the nation’s leading wind power state, told Yahoo News, “If he wants to do away with it, he’ll have to get a bill through Congress, and he’ll do it over my dead body.”

Grassley authored the original wind energy production tax credit in the 1990s and he’s been one of its biggest defenders in the Senate, which last year reauthorized the credit.

Trump, though, has long been hostile to wind energy, saying turbines are ugly — he once lost a legal battle to block an offshore wind farm near a golf course he owns in Scotland — and a threat to birds in the United States.

“The wind kills all your birds,” Trump said at an August rally. “All your birds, killed. You know, the environmentalists never talk about that.”

Wind turbines kill about 500,000 birds annually, according to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, a figure lower than bird deaths from cats or buildings.

Grassley told Yahoo that the tax credit for wind has been a boon to the economy in Iowa, which produces nearly one-third of its electricity from wind. y

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30 Responses to “Unstoppable. The More People see Wind Energy, the More they Like it”

  1. Tom Bates Says:

    The tax credit for wind or solar is the government stealing your money and giving it to someone else. In the case of wind, it is stealing the middle class money and giving it to the Al Gores of this world. In California where they have to live next to a wind farm like the Altamont pass, the people effected are always complaining of the view and noise, In Montana the eagles are not complaining , they are dead from running into the blades. The rate payers should be complaining as wind is not blowing all the time or to much or to little so other sources, read coal power plants are turned on to provide the difference. If the wind is blowing to much for the power demand the rate payers pay the wind farms to stop running. Pretty good deal for Al Gore, not so much for the middle class.

    • Don Osborn Says:

      Have you even ever been to the Altamont Pass? It is open grazing area and I suspect the cattle are not too vocal about any wind turbines. Wind farms do have a bird kill problem but it is much less than buildings, conventional power plants, cars, or cats. Wind (and solar) has been reducing energy costs for rate payers from CA to TX to the East.

    • Torsten Says:

      So Tom, is it correct to conclude that you are in favor of eliminating tax credits for fossil fuel producers?

    • Lionel Smith Says:

      Is this Tom Harris in a sock? Wind turbines are one of the favourite topics of that sad excuse for a modern human, as is the no warming canard.

      Whatever wind turbines have a grace of their own and can be the salvation of some communities isolated far from the grid.

      An article from The Telegraph , surprisingly it being the domain of one Christopher Booker.

      • Canman Says:

        They’re actually terrible for communities isolated far from the grid. When the wind is not blowing, there is no access to backup, unless they have diesel generators or sparked diesel running on natural gas. If the wind is generating excess energy, there is no way to export it.

        • greenman3610 Says:

          which is why all well informed people assume and plan for wind integrated as part of the grid with other renewable sources and storage.

    • miffedmax Says:

      Notice that Tommy has stopped pretending to provide cites for his claims ever since he got called out on his made-up NSS figures.


  2. More wanking from Master Bates. …Yes, it’s quite deafening up on Altamont. The wind is so loud, you really have to strain to hear those noisy generators. Shocking!


    • I visited a wind farm a few years ago. You could hear them operating … If you stood right next to the main support and listened hard enough as the blade rotated past it. Spoke to the property owner who told me the only noise he was aware of was from a neighbour who wasn’t in a prime generation position and therefore not earning anything from it.

      I could have asked one of the cows what they thought of it but that would make about as much sense as reading yet another poorly researched rant from Master Bates. 😝


  3. […] Source: Unstoppable. The More People see Wind Energy, the More they Like it | Climate Denial Crock of the We… […]

  4. dumboldguy Says:

    This past summer I visited the 10+ year old 5 turbine wind farm located on the grounds of the Atlantic County (NJ) Utilities Authority (ACUA) . The 1.5 MW 260 ft .tall (to the hub—250 ft. diameter across the blade tips—-380+ feet total) turbines are located around the perimeter of the sewage treatment plant, which sits in the marshes next to the road from the mainland to Atlantic City. You can google http://www.acua.com and see some pictures. They are visible from any west-facing rooms in any of the hotels and casinos.

    I was struck by how quiet they were—-the day was fairly windy—-all were turning at normal revs, and I could NOT hear any sound until I walked up close to the towers—-there was a narrow band from ~40 to 60 feet out where you could hear a quiet “swoosh” as the blades passed. I walked all over the facility to see if they could be heard and that was it.

    Master Bates using Altamont Pass as some sort of an example is typical of his BS—-it is one of the worst (if not the worst) wind farm sites in the country for many reasons. We are doing much better today.


  5. That headline could have been written by the AWEA! Who are you to define the tastes of the masses? Almost every new wind project encounters resistance for aesthetic reasons, pending rate hikes and the long-term futility of these machines. Unstoppable destruction of scenery is what’s really going on, at least until the PTC extension expires.

    Mere awareness that so much land is being industrialized angers many of us, even if we can’t see it directly. Environmentalists with a land ethic should understand that. Same goes for the large, remote area mined for Canadian tar sands, but at least it’s not scattered far and wide. Contiguous damage in only a few regions isn’t possible with wind turbines.

    Picture a wind array on a plain near a mountain front, like Colorado. One family might live west of it with a clear view of the mountains, while a few miles east it becomes a visual gauntlet. This calmly-spoken Australian video covers that and other problems, with a good noise demo: https://youtu.be/s_CZIfiFPwk

    Some True Believers claim that seeing more and more turbines is a penance for our past energy sins, but it’s ultimately a case of dumping in one’s own yard.

    https://evilnoisypeople.files.wordpress.com/2016/08/planet-of-the-apes-beach-with-wind-turbines.jpg?w=960&h=400

    • dumboldguy Says:

      “Who are you to define the tastes of the masses?” asks RS as HE then defines the tastes of the masses for us, i.e., we should all hate wind power. LMAO at his cluelessness, self-delusion, and lack of self-awareness.

      And he makes excuses for Canadian tar sands mining, ignoring the world-wide damage it does to the environment because “at least it’s not scattered far and wide”? LMAO again at the huge logic fail there.

      Go away, RS—–show some respect for silence by shutting up.

      • greenman3610 Says:

        obviously this is an unbalanced troll, so far down on the climate denial food chain he/she doesn’t even know who is pulling their strings.


        • Anyone who doesn’t want to see the world’s scenery ruined by garish machines must be a troll, you say? Why can’t you admit that carbon-reduction is not the only environmental concern on the planet? You are True Believers in an annoying, inefficient method of generating electricity. It’s just too big, noisy and lethal. When that’s pointed out, you deny it because you lack environmental ethics, especially a land ethic. See Aldo Leopold’s philosophy of minimal impact. John Muir would also have detested wind turbines. Unbroken scenery is a big aspect of wilderness. You can’t add huge volumes of looming, man-made junk to scenery and claim it’s no big deal.

          The wind industry started out with hypothetical promise when it was much smaller and experimental. It inevitably morphed into a series of mega construction projects feeding off subsidies, and lost its original purpose. But it was flawed from the start because there’s no way to do “big wind” without big impacts. You people ignore its dark side because you’re emotionally vested in its false promises. You chase the narrow idea that if something doesn’t burn oil, gas or coal (after being built) it’s automatically green, which is nonsense. You are defending large intrusions on nature that anger a lot of people and kill animals. As agenda-driven people (some of you are probably paid by the wind industry) your angle is to simply deny all harm. Can’t you see how arrogant that is?

          A good case study is Iberdrola (its name sounds like a disease) which wants to invest in a widely opposed hydro dam in the Amazon basin and is heavily into wind power. That Spanish firm is trying to push another big project into New York’s Tug Hill area, knowing that many locals resent the existing Maple Ridge turbines. Greenpeace opposes Iberdrola for its (water) dam plans but hypocritically sides with it on wind power (air dams). There’s big hypocrisy in the “renewables” business and it skates by on environmental buzzwords like Clean and Green. Companies like BP are doing the same thing, you know.

          https://www.google.com/search?q=Iberdrola+Belo+Monte+dam+Brazil

          Wind power is just morally wrong on a large scale. Enough damage has been done with a quarter million of those obscenities on the planet. Instead of trying to make it more “efficient” with bigger and uglier towers, it should be phased out and become a maintenance-only business, and eventually a dismantling operation. Thousands of clear-cuts and roads could be restored and concrete bases could be covered or maybe removed with explosives, for construction fill. Companies engaged in coal mining restoration could share that business.

          Solar power is silent and compact compared to wind power and it should take top priority. I don’t mean bird-frying desert arrays, just panels on roofs, parking lots, canals, etc. Real environmentalists prefer the smallest energy footprint possible and don’t get snarky when obvious blight is pointed out. If solar was accepted as a decentralized power source (leasing panels to homeowners on monthly bills) it could be far more effective.

          http://cutt.us/windpowertragedy

          • dumboldguy Says:

            Yes, RS IS quite obviously an “unbalanced troll” and a hopeless case with his fixation on wind turbines as the “only environmental concern on the planet”. He simply refuses to pay any attention to the REAL hierarchy of “environmental concerns”, which place “scenery” and “viewscapes” on the very bottom of the list of things that are needed to sustain the biosphere. He appears to be basically uneducable because of his Dunning Kruger problem and cognitive dissonance, so I’m going to stop feeding him after this comment.

            I won’t comment on his latest Gish Gallop of illogic other than to say that we are NOT defending “large intrusions on nature that anger a lot of people and kill animals”—-we are actually ATTACKING “large intrusions”, and as I said, wind turbines are FAR down the list of things like AGW and unsustainable life styles and economic systems that are endangering not just animals but every living thing on the planet and angering a lot of people (but not those dead people like Muir and Leopold that RS talks to via his Magic 8-Ball—they’re just dead and RS is delusional).

          • Mick Fidel Says:

            Good luck reaching anyone with reasoning on this snotty site. They had posts awhile back saying wind turbine syndrome is “bullshit” and totally denying ill effects from noise. The landscape issues are clear to everyone but you’re supposed to love the “new look” of the land or you’re Rush Limbaugh.

            I have experienced infrasound from a souped-up car stereo and know how strange and unbalancing it is. Living around variations of that must be hell, but anyone who brings it up is a liar to these snotty hipsters. When people can’t even CONSIDER opposing views based on many, many reports, something is rotten in their attitudes. If you watch this bloggers’s YouTube videos there’s a smugness to the delivery, though he’s right about global warming. Probably some wind shilling going on. Only report positive stuff or you don’t get paid for some side angle.

          • dumboldguy Says:

            It’s Mick Fidel again—we’ve seen him on Crock before:

            https://climatecrocks.com/2013/05/06/wind-turbine-noise-no-biggie-for-germans-why/

            https://climatecrocks.com/2014/11/08/new-study-confirms-again-wind-turbine-syndrome-is-bullshit/comment-page-1/

            He appears with that other anti-wind troll Alec Sevins (who may have changed his handle to Respect Silence since then). Mick was asked by me more than once if he was THE Mick Fidel who works in the coal industry in the Four Corners area, but he never replied.

            Now he’s here again whining about this “snotty site” and us “snotty hipsters” that visit here. LMAO!.

            And his stating “If you watch this bloggers’s YouTube videos there’s a smugness to the delivery, though he’s right about global warming” is priceless! “SMUGNESS to the delivery”? Hmmmmmm—–yes, I guess so, if you consider a certain level of confident reporting because you have good info and good science behind your work—-far better than the mindless and ignorant “smugness” one find on sites like WUWT that have only bullshit backing them.

            And “Probably some wind shilling going on. Only report positive stuff or you don’t get paid for some side angle?” is real sour grapes and “pot-kettle” stuff. . Just like Mick gets paid for shilling AGAINST wind by the fossil fuel folks? I DO hope Peter gets some $$$$ support from people who are on the RIGHT side of the climate change issue and are trying to make a buck at it. In this modern world of marketing, that’s the way it’s done.

            Go away Mick—-go play in your coal piles and continue to suck your thumb because you and coal are losers and no one wants to listen to your deluded bullshit. Take Alec Sevins/Respect Silence with you. BTW, here’s a comment that Alec/Respect received for his efforts after he wore out his welcome trolling on Cleantechnica.

            “Oh, bullshit, Alec. Take your FUD elsewhere. I am so tired of you lying anti-wind, pro coal jerks”.

            Ditto for you, Mick—-go away, trolls.


      • I won’t post anymore in this thread but I’ll be very blunt with you people. You are no less a group of smug a-holes than climate deniers, and worse with respect to your cognitive dissonance. You pretend to care about the environment while supporting the biggest rural construction projects in history. Some of you may have an epiphany 5 or 10 years on, like “Now, I see this was a big mistake. We blew it.” Just give it time, and enough turbines. But True Believers won’t stop until the planet is fully “saved,” i.e. http://windtoons.com/images/l24Wind-farm-promoter-Game-Over.gif

        You ask me to go away because you have no aesthetic defenses of wind power, just like climate deniers who are obviously about supporting oil, gas and coal industries. They just yell at people who post cogent moral arguments. Big wind is much closer to big oil than you’ll admit. It’s all about manufacturing, mining, logging, blasting, road building, trucking and crane rigging. That’s what it takes to get huge machines installed in the hundreds of thousands.

        A better writer than myself sums it up here:

        From http://dark-mountain.net/blog/doug-tompkins-remembered/

        “…I get into these arguments all the time about these huge wind power stations going up all over open land, and many environmentalists have this unquestioning acceptance of this. They just think, oh it’s wind, it’s a renewable technology, that’s progress, we like that, anyone who doesn’t is a friend of fossil fuel or the nuclear industry. And they’ll be out there arguing for the mass destruction of open landscapes in the name of getting “clean energy” for a purpose they haven’t identified yet. And you get all these spurious arguments, all these people saying, “but these things are beautiful, they’re so elegant! You have to learn to love them. My heart leaps up every time I see a five-hundred-foot wind turbine on a mountain!” And that’s mainstream environmentalism today, and if you’re against that you’re a reactionary and a romantic. And it’s astonishing to see how quickly this has happened, and how unquestioningly – and how the progressive narrative that environmentalism used to challenge has been dragged in to the argument to support this case.”

        That article is about a guy who created outdoor recreation companies, then got tired of what they’d turned into and spend the last years of his life trying to save nature from hordes of people and development. That’s what real environmentalists do.

        http://cutt.us/windpowertragedy


        • P.S. One more quote is needed from the aforementioned article, since it really gets to the heart of the issue. Pay attention to Tompkins’ statement about climate change and wind power being a continuum, not the latter solving the former.

          http://dark-mountain.net/blog/doug-tompkins-remembered/

          “When I look at one of those giant turbines, I see the icon of techno-industrial culture. I see the contemporary expression of the Enlightenment, of Cartesian logic, the scientific revolution and then the Industrial Revolution and then the information revolution. I see this as all symbolised there, as if it were a logotype. I see it as the iconography of all that. And that whole techno-industrial society that we’ve created as an expression of the Enlightenment, you can go back and see how that whole worldview has been channelled over five hundred years. What is it? It’s global climate change! That’s the result. The way of thinking that could create those windmills is the same way of thinking that caused climate change in the first place. Just imagine for a minute, just step back and imagine ruining the whole climate! That’s the result of the techno-industrial culture which these Big Wind turbines symbolise. And I know that it requires the whole enchilada of techno-industrial culture just to produce one of these things. It requires all the mining, all the alloys, all the computers – the whole scaffolding of civilisation. And that scaffolding is undoing the world. That’s what I see when I see your big windmill on the mountain. And for that reason, I don’t think it is desirable.”

          • dumboldguy Says:

            Don’t know if this will appear on the thread, since the comment I’m replying to didn’t, but I must wish RS a fond farewell and invite him to return to Crock after he gets better educated, gets treatment for his personality disorders, and grows up (preferably all of the above).

            That’s an excellent and insightful piece from Dark Mountain that he linked, when looked at in totality. Too bad that RS couldn’t resist cherry picking out a short quote that he THINKS supports his case, while ignoring the real messages of the lengthy discussion the piece recounts, which he missed entirely.

  6. Alec Sevins Says:

    Unstoppable implies endless development of nature, which is exactly what the wind industry seeks. Substitute the term urban sprawl or housing-starts for wind energy and it’s all part of the same trend. The construction business is driven by endless building, resulting in less natural acreage, and wind power is no exception. In fact, it’s the biggest example in terms of acreage and visibility.

    Exactly how many of these towering eyesores do wind fanatics want to see?America already has a fifth of the world’s quarter-million wind turbines. Do you want to see 100k, 200k, 500k, or a million at some point? How about 2 million? How much scenery must be converted into industrial parks before the planet is officially saved? None of you will answer that truthfully because you know those machines are too big to hide, and you think they’re “too big to fail.”

    In the wind business, rural lands are unimportant for their pastoral qualities or relaxation. They are just another commodity in the global marketplace. Big Wind is business as usual, pretending to be a rebel against fossil fuels. It’s all about how many gigawatts of “clean” energy they can provide distant cities as they make the countryside dirtier. Below is what “unstoppable” looks like outside these propaganda blogs, and you want more of it?

    https://postimg.org/image/qbwb9em83/

    https://www.facebook.com/Wind-Turbines-are-Obscene-Rural-Skyscrapers-1427977880816189/

    • dumboldguy Says:

      So, Respect Silence fades away and Alec Sevins reappears—-and they sound like exactly the same person. Is RS really AS and vice-versa? No matter, he/they is/are just anti-wind troll(s). I wonder which fossil fuel group they whore for?

      And why do they think ANYONE is going to buy the argument that “scenery is more important than preventing the extinction of all life on Earth”?

      ZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzz………!!!!!

  7. Mick Fidel Says:

    For dumboldguy who’s in love with wind power no matter what:

    This site had no reply button directly under your post. I don’t check this much and I work in electronics. This was a handle for a potential audio site. Mic(k) = Microphone, and add some letters to the other word. There is no coal conspiracy. I just like things to look and sound as natural as possible, like a normal person should.

    Coal has already done its main damage and we were born into that world. Now wind power is doing a whole new number on the environment and you can’t handle the facts. You remind me of milder Sandy Hook Truthers who won’t talk to victims’ families while calling them liars. If you want to do some actual research, find a list of wind turbine victims and take a road trip to interview them. Call them liars to their faces and see how it works out.

    Wind turbine noise is a huge deal and you can easily find audible, primary noise recordings. Infrasound is hard to record due to microphone membrane inertia, but you can mimic it with subwoofers and a tone generator. Machines with blades that sweep an acre are going to have a big impact on someone. Reports that they spook animals are also logical.

    It looks like you’ve pissed off another forum with the same unreachable style.

    https://fractalplanet.wordpress.com/discussions/general-climate-discussion-4/comment-page-4/ “You are the most annoying and useless poster on here since dumboldguy.”

    • dumboldguy Says:

      Nice try, Mick, but your attempt at word play and “rebranding” yourself as an “electronics” guy sounds like pure bullshit to me. The chances of someone calling themselves Mick Fidel speaking against wind power on a climate change site NOT being “the coal guy Mick Fidel” are miniscule. I will repeat some of what I said earlier to Alec/Respect and you:

      “BTW, here’s a comment that Alec/Respect received for his efforts after he wore out his welcome trolling on Cleantechnica. “Oh, bullshit, Alec. Take your FUD elsewhere. I am so tired of you lying anti-wind, pro coal jerks”. Ditto for you, Mick—-you are an anti-wind, pro-coal troll and you can’t bullshit your way out of it.

      You say “Coal has already done its main damage and we were born into that world”—–LOL—-translation—-“We should keep using some coal because it hasn’t killed us all yet and I need my job”

      Wind power is doing “a whole new number on the environment” that is nowhere near the “number” done by burning fossil fuels, and that’s a fact that YOU don’t want to “handle”. Give us a list of wind turbine “victims”, Mick. It may be at most a couple of hundred names long—-compare that to the 7,000,000 deaths each year attributed to fossil fuels (who we can’t talk to because they’re all dead and buried).

      I mentioned elsewhere that I had spent the better part of two hours this summer touring a site that had five 1.5 MW wind turbines—-walked everywhere under and around them and touched the tower with my hand. Found them to be almost silent and rather benign. Yes, they ARE BIG, and DO intrude on the view some. Have YOU walked under and up to a turbine and touched it?—-didn’t think so. So save your bullshit about recordings and electronics—-most of the turbines are out in the middle of nowhere and bother NO ONE.

      I have to laugh at your weak attempt at putting me down because of my “unreachable style”. Yes, that very deliberately chosen “style” DOES piss off many morons (including you) and it does get me thrown off some sites (the last being that moronic ToadLiquor—check that out too). I have been gone from Fractal Planet for many months now. The comment you cite—- “You are the most annoying and useless poster on here since dumboldguy.—-was made back in April by someone who came on Crock earlier, behaved like a complete anal orifice, and was driven away by me—-he invited me to visit FP so he could “tear me a new one”. His name was Bryant Morganelli, but he goes by bobcobblog or some such there (I called him CobJob, but he doesn’t know what that means). He is one of exactly FIVE people who post on Scott Johnson’s vanity blog FP (Scott being one of them). IMO, Scott maintains FP just so he can say he has a blog and help sell his articles to ArsTechnica and its ilk. Bryant/CobJob fills the role of the village idiot on Fractal Planet, and is one of the best examples of Dunning Kruger on the web. I can see why you would value his opinion.

      So, Mick, why don;t you take your bullshit elsewhere—“I am so tired of you anti-wind, pro-coal trolls” says it for me too.

      • Mick Fidel Says:

        My “bullshit” is defending what’s left of rural lands before fraudulent environmentalism began ruining them. Good environmentalists don’t look the other way when bad stuff happens just because they’ve taken a side with it.

        Your bullshit is insulting people because you enjoy it. Let me provide you with a mirror: http://dcstructural.com/stupid_stuff/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Basement_Dweller-1.jpg

        You’ll just keep yapping about a pro-coal conspiracy, I know. What a waste of bandwidth.

        • dumboldguy Says:

          You say “My bullshit is insulting people because I enjoy it”? Not so, Mick. I am a charter member of P.O.O.P. (People Offended by Offended People), and members of P.O.O.P. have a sworn civic duty to “insult” human insects like you.

          Thank you for the “mirror”—–are you the basement dweller in the pic? You are just dumb enough to take a selfie and use it in that way. I think my reply to your other comment will suffice to show that YOU are the “basement dweller” here.

  8. Mick Fidel Says:

    I have nothing to do with the coal industry, you paranoid conclusion-jumper. My icon is a microphone, in case you’re blind (as you are to 500 foot machines). Being against a sickening assault on rural lands doesn’t make someone pro-coal. It makes them pro-soul.

    You’re probably a basement dweller who can’t figure out if he’s an environmentalist or a gadfly. Picking one form of energy and defending it no matter what is crank behavior. There’s a reason you see far more complaints about wind turbines than solar panels. They’re an affront to normal senses and logic.

    Wind energy is the same path of destruction you hate in coal, fracking and all the other dirty things. People chop off mountaintops and pull stuff from them, or chop them off and stick ugly spikes on them. They say the spikes aren’t ugly because that’s all they can do. The main difference is that one got a rep as new and green and the other is old school. The carbon issue became a wedge distraction.

    Go take your meds and get outside once in awhile. We’re supposed to look at trees and mountains in rural places, not noisy machines out of scale with their surroundings. The cities are where those belong. Don’t you get it at all?

    • dumboldguy Says:

      I must apologize to the real Michael Fidel. Although he DOES work at the very nasty San Juan coal-burning power plant in NM, and the name is so uncommon that I jumped to the conclusion that he was the one trolling here, OUR Mick Fidel’s whining caused me to look deeper and discover that OUR Mick Fidel is indeed what he seems to be—-not an executive with a real job and real duties at a power plant in NM who wants to preserve his job, but a childish basement-dwelling troll in Portland, OR who posts some incredibly offensive things in obscure places. To wit (and these are all authenticated by the “microphone icon”.

      9/11/16 comment on KGW site—Portland, OR
      Mick Fidel
      “There’s a lot of environmental hypocrisy and foot-dragging in this supposedly green town. Unnecessary engine idling (despite more signs against it than I’ve seen anywhere) is another example. The scenery alone doesn’t mean attitudes are green. A redneck element in certain industries sees pollution as OK as long as people aren’t coughing. The general level of intellect up here is overstated”.

      4/14/16 comment on a FOX12 Oregon site—Portland, OR
      Mick Fidel
      “Are there any Escalade drivers who aren’t d-bags on some level? I’ve yet to see one. That whole vehicle is about ego and fuel gluttony”.
      (This was in response to a piece about a hit-and-run auto accident in which the driver of an Escalade killed two people)

      Mick Fidel 6/21/16 on the “Medium” site
      “Getting gun nuts (the ranks of whom include trophy hunters) to admit that they are generally evil, is another vital step in this fight. They identify themselves with “patriotism” and “freedom” but most are just self-absorbed, crummy people. They use guns as a security blanket and ego-booster, well beyond any rational need to own numerous models. They also side with other right-wing causes and conspiracy theories that drag down the civilized world”

      And the “going out in a blaze of glory” finale. Microphone Boy commented on 5/22/16 on the “Elite Daily” site on a piece titled “This Woman Is Using Fruit To Show You Exactly How To Finger A Woman” which was actually a photographic artwork . It drew only four comments, including Microphone Boy’s and a rather strong rebuttal from a young man with a working brain.

      Mick Fidel
      “Another self-absorbed tease, along the lines of yoga pants. A waste of food, also”..

      Jeremy John Quintrell •
      Santa Rosa Junior College
      “Hey mick. Let me pick you apart really quick. Tease? Yoga pants? So what you are saying here is if a woman wears yoga pants and it accentuates parts of her body but you can’t do as you please with her body, she is a tease? How in any way on this god forsaken planet is this ok? Your needs over all women? If you see it and you like it, you should get it or she is a tease?”

      “You are gross and this art is genius and beautiful for what it does”.

      So, Microphone Boy who lives in Mom’s basement and apparently doesn’t get out much at all? Why don’t you go back to making dumb ass comments on other sites and leave us in peace to discuss climate change as adults on Crock? You obviously don’t get much at all, and are a real “wedge distraction” here..


  9. “Oh, one more thing,” as detective Columbo used to say:

    I bet you’ll have some difficulty spinning what happened in Ontario, Canada, last month. Turbine-ravaged farmers and rate payers finally prevailed! The alien hell they were going through is never acknowledged by slick scenery-killers. But America is seeing more and more what those machines do to the quality of life and they will not be “unstoppable” in a fair democracy.

    Actually, you’ll probably harp on the overcapacity factor as Ontario’s logic, not the sheer blight of those machines, which is really what angers rural people. Anything that can be spun will be.

    Web search with a few headers from articles:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=Ontario+suspends+green+energy+wind+2016

    Ontario cancels future green energy plans | Ontario | News | Toronto Sun
    http://www.torontosun.com/2016/…/cash-strapped-ontario-government-cancels...
    Toronto Sun: Tuesday, September 27, 2016 09:08 AM EDT | Updated: Tuesday, September … Green Energy Act: Ontario government still sees no evil · Green Energy Act falling…

    Ontario government scraps plan for $3.8 billion in renewable energy …
    http://www.thestar.com › News › Queen’s Park Toronto Star
    Sep 27, 2016 – 27, 2016. Ontario is blowing off plans for more wind and solar power as it feels the heat over high electricity bills less than two years before a…

    Ontario suspends green energy plan, wind projects Green Energy …
    greenenergyinvesting.net › green energy investing
    Sep 27, 2016 – Home green energy investing Ontario suspends green energy plan, wind projects … September 27, 2016 … Critics of wind energy had argued the new round of green energy procurement that was underway would add costly…

    …etc…

    One of the better anti wind power sites is from one of the hardest hit areas. Their anger is palpable if you drop the conspiracy theories and put yourself in their shoes, like fair-minded people: http://ontario-wind-resistance.org/not-a-willing-host/

    ClimateCrocks definition of a troll: Someone who says they respect landscapes and must have conspiratorial reasons for hating wind power because we think they’re beautiful and we are all-knowing! But at the same time, we can’t argue honestly because we know scenery is being ruined, so we create strawmen out of these terrible people who disrupt our WindHeaven.


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